Devoted to the Propagation and Defense of New Testament Christianity
VOLUME 11
June 4, 1959
NUMBER 5, PAGE 12b,13b-14

News

The Donley-Hayden Debate

Richard E. Donley, P. O.Box 223, White Plains, New York: "From the mail I receive, it seems that a good many of the brethren want to know the outcome of my debate with H. B. Hayden. This debate grew out of a meeting with Mr. Hayden in a home Bible class. He declared his readiness to defend his views at any place, and his friend L. J. Insigna of Mahopac Falls offered the use of their building. The only time the two Baptist preachers would agree to was Sunday afternoon, and by that means they avoided having very many hear the discussion.

On April 5th a group of people assembled at the Baptist meeting house in Mahopac Falls for the debate. Insigna served as moderator. I affirmed the necessity of water baptism. Hayden affirmed that the one baptism of Eph. 4:5 is the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. Each man had a thirty-minute affirmative, and a thirty-minute negative speech. I made about the same arguments on baptism that would be made by anyone who knows and believes the New Testament. In my negative speech I simply showed that the one baptism of Eph. 4:5 was in the present tense when Ephesians was written, and that baptism in the name of the Lord is in water.

Hayden tried to debate during his affirmative speech, but his negative consisted of a personal attack on me and my brethren in general. It was evident that he could offer no scriptural rebuttal.

The church in White Plains, and the one in Poughkeepsie, each pressed Mr. Hayden to continue the discussion, but he said he was too busy."

Church of Christ, Pineville, Missouri: "We the members of the Church of Christ in Pineville, Missouri, are trying to obtain the services of a full-time minister. We are hoping to get some support. This is a mission field here and the preacher would have to be supported by a congregation or congregations, until we could be self-supporting. We have a membership of 22 with 6 faithful men. We have managed to build us a new building, the auditorium will seat about 180, with 4 class rooms. We are a new church, a little over two years old, first time there was ever a church of our Lord here. Any help the brethren could give would be very much appreciated. Our aim is to keep pressing onward, may God help us to see the church grow in spirit and truth. Any who are interested may write to: Church of Christ, Pineville, Missouri, C/O E. P. Rickman."

Jady Copeland, 4101 Curzon, Fort Worth 7, Texas: "Due To The Fact That Some Members Have Left The Congregation Here, Thus Leaving Us With More Work And Expense Than We Can Handle, We At The Calmont Church Of Christ Are Having To Drop Our Support Of Brother Ludwig Hopfl, Of Germany. We Were Supporting Him $50.00 Per Month, And He Was Receiving Some Elsewhere, I Understand. As Far As We Have Been Able To Determine, He Has Done A Good Work, So If There Is A Church Able To Help Support Him, You May Address Him As Follows: Mozartstrasse 12, Munich 12, Germany. I Write This Because It Is My Understanding That Unless Some Church Helps Him, He Will Have To Return To Secular Work To Support Himself. I Do Not Know Bro. Hopfl Personally, But As Stated Above, It Appears From Reports We Have Received, That He Has Been Doing A Good Work."

Another Good Debate In Phoenix

Derrel Starling, Phoenix, Arizona: "For eight nights between April 13 and 23, Brother Wilson M. coon or the Westside church and Brother Bill Runt of the Southwest church discussed present problems in the church. The discussion alternated between the Westside building and the Southwest building. Each speaker spoke once each night for 50 minutes. Good crowds were in attendance for most every session.

Brother Hunt began the debate by talking for 47 minutes about the "anti's", "legalists," "troublemakers" and "hobbyists" in the church, referring to those that oppose human arrangements in the work of evangelism and benevolence. Throughout the debate he used the many times answered arguments of attempting to make Philippi and Jerusalem sponsoring church, the component parts, asking where the Bible said "how" to do it and by appealing to sympathy. Brother Coon made his component parts argument look sick by showing that it could just as easily be applied to church support of colleges, church hospitals and the missionary society. In fact, when on the subject of benevolence Brother Hunt had listed nine numerals to be filled in with component parts but he never got but five of them on the board. Never once was it proven that there was a sponsoring church in New Testament times; it was only assumed. Brother Coon pointed out that the discussion was not over the "how", but that it was over organization.

Brother Coon did an excellent job of presenting the word of God in a straight forward manner. He began the debate with a masterful lesson on Bible authority and the second night delivered a devastating sermon on apostasy. Brother Coon's superior speaking and debating ability stood out in the discussion, especially since he had no human "clap traps" (as he called them) to defend.

The first night of the debate was in the Southwest building and at the close of the service, Brother Burnett, Brother Hunt's moderator, had the gall to extend an invitation to those present to come out of anti-ism and take their stand with the "truth". Brother Coon then spoke out during the invitation song with words of "encouragement" for all to come on down and take their stand with the liberals and digressives and with the church kitchen and church recreation crowd. The following night Brother Coon showed that such an invitation was nothing but the height of hypocrisy since the moderator had initiated the debate with the exhortation for all to study with an open mind. Suffice it to say that no other such invitations were extended.

In the course of the discussion Brother Coon pointed out that Brother Hunt would no longer be able to consistently condemn instrumental music since it was opposed on the same basis that was used to oppose the missionary society, sponsoring churches and human societies in benevolence. Brother Coon said it would be interesting to hear Brother Hunt use five minutes of his (Coon's) time to try to oppose instrumental music and Brother Hunt accepted and used the exclusion argument and thus proved Brother Coon's statement regarding the matter and that human arrangements to do the work of the church are excluded because not authorized by God.

Brother Coon never let the audience forget that here in Phoenix they have an organization, or society, to receive money from churches to care for children and that this organization has been in existence for about two years but they are still not providing a home (shelter) for such children. The churches were thus shown to be contributing to an organization, a central agency, and not to an orphan home. Brother Coon drew a diagram of many churches contributing to an organization and this organization was in turn to provide the care for the children, but as yet were not doing it. He called on Brother Hunt for scriptural proof for such an organization but it was never given. It was very clear to the audience that Brother Hunt was confusing the orphan home (shelter) with the "entity", or the organization. Brother Hunt was unable to answer this and so in the last speech of the debate he just erased Brother Coon's diagram and talked about other matters and introduced at least one new major argument and at least eight new charts to which Brother Coon had no reply.

C. L. McLean, Box 124, White House, Tennessee: "In November of 1958 L. Wesley Jones flew me to Canada. I preached for the church in Collingwood. It is their desire that my family and I move there to labor with the church there. The church in Collingwood has about 15 members. They have three wage earners out of that number. These brethren have bought and paid for a building seating about 100. There is a full size concreted basement under the building that we hope to build into class rooms some day. Collingwood is located on the Georgian Bay 90 miles Northwest of Toronto; its population is between 8 to 10 thousand; it is the only congregation in Simcoe County with a population of well over 100,000. Barrie is a town somewhat larger than Collingwood without a member of the Lord's church. Barrie has a Radio station and a television station that we could get some time on.

Collingwood brethren feel that they could furnish us a place to live — that is the extent of their ability at the present — We hope to raise the rest of our support here in the states. At first our plans were to leave the states for Canada in July of this year but we have not made much progress in raising our support yet. We first asked for $90.00 weekly support but was advised by brother W. L. Watson an elder of the First Street Congregation in Lawrenceburg, Tennessee to try to raise $100.00. We will still go if we can get $85.00 weekly support. Our expenses will be rather high and we want to purchase some radio or TV time. Would you publish an appeal in the Guardian for any congregation that would like to help me and my family move into this field? We plan to establish, 'the Lord willing", congregations in all of Simcoe Co. Due to the slowness with which we have been able to raise support for this work and the Canadian Duty charges on personal possessions not owned more than six months, September will be our earliest possible moving date.

The Taylor Blvd. Congregation in Louisville, Kentucky has promised to pay our moving expenses."

Edgar Furr, Box 1175, Ingleside, Texas: "I have not reported in some time. The work in Ingleside is doing fine with 23 additions in the past year. We have had four meetings, the last being conducted by Brother Foy E. Wallace, Jr. His preaching was never better. We have helped in the starting of a new congregation in Port Aransas, seven miles off shore on Mustang Island. Those vacationing at Port Aransas will find the church meeting in the community center. Services at the usual hours. Our son, Joe Ed and Brother C. T. McLain take care of the preaching and mid-week services."

Joe F. Moore, Box 625, Portales, New Mexico: "Brother Mack Kercheville of El Paso, Texas preached for the University Drive Church of Christ during our April meeting. Seven were baptized during the meeting, two the week before. The church here is scheduling a debate between P. D. Ballard of the Landmark Missionary Baptist Church, and W. Curtis Porter. Dates have not been set, but we expect it to be in June or July. The University Drive Church of Christ is offering my services to hold two or three meetings this year for small congregations which are not able to pay for such. If interested, please contact us."

Robert A. Bolton, P. O.Box 242, Mount Pleasant, Texas: "Hoyt H. Houchen of Lufkin, Texas did an excellent job of preaching the gospel in our spring meeting, April 27 through May 6. Four were baptized, 2 restored, and 2 identified. Four more obeyed the gospel on Sunday morning following the meeting. Our daily radio program at 6:45 A M on KIMP, 960 kcs continues to bear fruit. Ward Hogland of Houston, Texas will be with us in a combination meeting and V.B.S. August 10 through 19. All phases of the work here are on the increase with 1959 contributions averaging $90 per week above the 1958 average, and attendance, interest and enthusiasm are excellent. Southside is one of the best. Come and see!"

A New Kind Of "Heretic" ...

Guthrie Dean, Bald Knob, Arkansas: "It was my pleasure to attend a student-debate at a recent Monday night meeting at Harding College. The subject, church support to a benevolent home under a board. I commend the College for allowing such free and open discussion of the current issues. But at least one of the professors was not pleased with the outcome of the debate. He told some after the dismissal that only one side of the issues should be presented to the students. He admitted that his view on the homes was merely his OPINION; but he added with some bit of emphasis, "All who don't agree with my opinion on the Orphan homes are plain HERETICS!" I am sure he admitted more than he intended to. But he expressed his position and the position of a number of others I know. They cry that church support to institutional homes is only a "method", only a "means", only "one way of doing it." But, brother, you just dare cross their "way of doing it" and P-O-W you are branded a HERETIC. That reminds me so much of the Roman Church and its attitude toward those who disagree with it. Brethren, we are duty bound to love each other more than that."

The Elders, Park Hill Church of Christ, Fort Smith, Ark.: "Brother Ward Hogland who worked with this congregation for nine years, and who is now working with the Spring Branch congregation of Houston, Texas returned after being away a little over a year to preach in our gospel meeting held April 20th through 26th. We feel that much good was accomplished in many ways. The services were well attended, the gospel of Jesus Christ was preached in its simplicity, six souls were baptized into the Lord's body, and we pray that much good will yet come from the seed that was -sown during this meeting. We enjoyed very much this renewed association and work with Brother Hogland and look forward to the future for more of the same pleasant association and work with Brother Hogland and his fine family. The church here was further encouraged during a portion of the meeting by the presence of Brother and Sister Cecil B. Douthitt of Brown-wood, Texas, who will move here to work permanently with us beginning June 1st. We feel that Park Hill is in the threshold of the greatest opportunity it has ever had to be of service in spreading the borders of the kingdom by the help of God and the prayers of the faithful. We invite you to visit and worship with us when in this vicinity."

Ralph R. Givens, 1234 Division Street, Oceanside, Calif.: "If you have a son or other relative serving in the Marines or the Navy and stationed at Camp Pendleton please tell them of the church in Oceanside which meets at the address above. The main gate of Camp Pendleton is just outside the city limits of Oceanside. If you would like for us to contact someone there, please send me their complete address."

James E. Cooper, 107 Elm St., Campbellsville, Kentucky: "I would like for you to announce my debate with Raymond S. Bennett, preacher for the Christian Church in Jamestown, Kentucky. The discussion will be conducted at Campbellsville, Kentucky on June 4th. I will affirm, `It is contrary to Scripture to use mechanical instruments of music in the worship of God, and therefore sinful.' On June 5th, Mr. Bennett will affirm, 'It is in harmony with Scripture to use mechanical instruments of music in the worship of God.' The discussion will be for only two nights. I closed a meeting at Merrimac in Taylor County on May 5th, in which two were baptized. I begin Monday night, May 18 at Jamestown, Kentucky and will continue through May 27. Donald Townsley of Lebanon, Kentucky will preach in our meeting June 7-14."

John Bullock, Box 726, Farmersville, Texas: "My recent meeting with the church in Wynnewood, Oklahoma, resulted in eleven responses, seven were baptized, and four restored. My next meeting is with the church in Myrtle Springs, Texas, July 13-19."